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A Conversation for CELTIC DEVON<br><br>I am hopeful that this discussion will move across to H2G2 - I realize that BBC Devon are hoping to achieve this. However - just in case this discussion 'freezes' I believed I'd inform all that there is certainly a Devon Celtic Language web-site about to be launched. This might have already been the language of the legendary King Arthur. It was absolutely the 'common ancestor' of contemporary day Breton and Cornish languages. The language has been recreated by way of a handbook by linguist Joseph Biddulph and this web site will deliver an extremely very brief taste of it, in addition to a opportunity to study additional. It will be great to view this ancient language resurrected. 2 Cornish for Devonians. We know the Celtic language survived in Devon for some time after the period above. As far as I can inform the Cornish language (itself a resurrection via a handbook published by Jenner a century ago) may be the closest we can get to what Devon's language was. The site will give a link to (some significantly less political) Cornish language sources as well as a chance to join a forum exactly where you do not must pretend you will be Cornish! three Devon Celtic placenames four Devons Celtic Saints. All this can be complementary[http://cheaptomsshoeoutlet.net/ cheap toms shoes] for the discussions that (hopeully) will continue right here on the 'Celtic Devon' web site (wherever that ends up getting). In reality - if this surives it will be a[http://tomsoutletshoes.net/ toms shoes] great forum to talk about these issues!!<br><br>Hello everyone, hope you remember me from the devon flag campaign! glad to determine the forum is alive and nicely. seeking at all of the stuff you could now obtain with the Devon flag on it, it appears it was all worth the tough work. the discussion on language and celtic survival is good, i've seriously enjoyed reading it. I was so angry in the guy in the celtic league demanding that Mr. Flag take the flag in the list of celtic nations/regions that i wanted him to know he was behaving like a nazi, one particular man deciding who was and who wasn't allowed inside the 'club'. Anyway normally down in axemouth flying the flag on my dad's boat and finding a great deal of interest(even an old sea-dog form standing up and saluting it!) each of the greatest London Devonish<br><br>London Devonish - the return on the prodigal son! Excellent to hear that the Devon Flag continues to be flying in Axemouth! You refer to a member on the Celtic League asking to take down the Devon Flag in the list of Celtic nations/regions. Exactly where or when was this? Have I missed some thing or am I going senile (rather possible). The only issue I can recall is some Cornish dude (or three) getting angry about the mention - and Mr Flag did alter the words - slightly. Absolutely Mr Flag's web page still has the Devon Flag below the 'Celtic' nations section.<br><br>Ozzie Exile, I think that it was the irate Cornish Nationalist who London Devonish was referring to, as he stated that he will be raising the matter using the Celtic League in the time. As we have received no stern warnings (joke) from the Celtic League about our flag, I can only assume that the Celtic League treated his plea using the contempt it deserved. I've identified in my dealings with persons in the other Celtic regions that they think the Cornish Nationalist extremists are total cranks, just as considerably as we do. Incidentally, talking of cranks, a certain Nick person has turned up at the Gesithas website and has started to possess a go at us again. I'm concocting a single of my put-downs for him at the moment. London Devonish, Great to hear from you once again. Have you visited Ozzie Exile's "Devon's Celtic language" website yet, that is just receiving started. We could do with some fresh input. Plymouth Exile<br><br>Einion, "Place Names of Devon" states that less than 1% of Devon place names are Celtic in origin. You'll find two key reasons for this statement. Firstly, PN Devon only lists key location names, and the majority of the Celtic names in Devon are minor names of compact hamlets and farmsteads. It can be mostly the names of towns and bigger villages that a single sees on most maps that show both Devon and Cornwall, so the difference among the two counties is a lot more apparent at this scale (PN Devon lists only 3 'tre' names at this scale, whereas you can find no less than thirty). Secondly, PN Devon assumes that just about all names containing roots which include 'combe', 'dun', 'tor', 'pol', 'cors', and so on. are English names as they assume that these Celtic words had been borrowed into English. As Devon is complete of places with names containing these roots (specially 'combe'), this assumption reduces the supposed number of Celtic (or partly Celtic) names drastically. The histories in the Devon towns differ from those in Cornwall. In Devon, a number of towns grew up throughout the boom in woollen manufacture in the 14th and 15th centuries, at a time when the Brythonic language was either dead, or in decline. Consequently, these woollen business towns acquired English names. There was no such woollen boom in Cornwall. Right here, the smaller s[http://tomsoutletauthentic.net/ toms shoes outlet]ized towns and the vil[http://www.longchampsale2013.com/ long champ]lages have been settlements, which grew from tiny farmsteads or hamlets and these retained their original Cornish names. That is why a number of Cornish towns and villages have names beginning with 'Tre' (meaning 'farmstead'), since that may be what they initially had been. Returning to the names in Devon containing the 'combe', 'tor', 'dun' and so on. elements, I really feel that the 'borrowed' explanation is no longer tenable. This theory was introduced in Victorian instances when it was fashionable to believe that the Britons didn't survive the Anglo-Saxon invasion/settlement outside of Wales and Cornwall, so some explanation had to be given for the apparently substantial quantity of Celtic spot names in counties for example Devon. Now that we know for specific (from DNA surveys) that the descendents of the Britons (Celts) considerably outnumber the descendents from the Saxons inside the entire from the South West (not just Cornwall), the 'borrowed' explanation loses it credibility. Are we expected to believe that a comparatively compact number of Saxons settled in Devon and renamed the houses of all of the Britons, who have been currently living there, and named their own houses, making use of 'borrowed' Celtic names, and yet continued to speak their very own language? Add to this the observation that several names containing the element 'pen', which are clearly Celtic in origin, which include 'Pennycombe' (close to Exeter) have been ascribed as possessing an English derivation (which means 'enclosure inside the valley), in lieu of the considerably additional clear Celtic derivation (which means 'head with the valley'), which precisely describes its location. Once again we see the assumption that 'pen' would be the English word for enclosure and 'combe' can be a 'borrowed' word and consequently also English. How do they explain the equivalent Welsh name 'Penycwm' near St. Davids in Wales? I bet they would not claim it to be English.<br><br>Plymouth Exile, It makes sense that the boom inside the woollen industry can be a massive factor in the distinction of place names between Devon and Cornwall, that is a thing I had'nt definitely thought of. Would it be the comparative hilliness of Devon which caused such a boom in wool? I've noticed that north-west Cornwall has much more Devon-style names, which, going by the technique of roads etc., is additional hilly than the rest of Cornwall (I am from Australia by the way, so I primarily know Devon and Cornwall by maps and photos). Do you know of anywhere online I could view a smaller sized scale map of Devon which includes farmsteads and hamlets? The concept that the Saxons decided to borrow a lot of additional Celtic names in Devon and also the west than elsewhere in England is indicative of your great lengths some people are prepared to go to in help of their pet concepts; it's practically laughable to feel (and realise!) that some historians take the concept seriously. Speaking of such suggestions, I think I've heard it stated that the prefix 'beer' (as in Beercrocombe) is of Saxon origin. It seems to become virtually exclusively confined for the south-western peninsula of Britain, so I have wondered whether or not it is actually basically of Celtic origin. Would that be a appropriate assumption?<br><br>Einion, I had a rapid search on-line, but I couldn't locate any maps of Devon, which show detail down to person farms. To obtain an precise impression with the place-name components employed for farms and hamlets, there isn't any substitute for the GB Ordnance Survey 1:50,000 and 1:25,000 series maps. Having said that in her book "The Landscape of Place-Names", Margaret Gelling states: "Combe is a lot far more prevalent in South West England than in any other area. Ekwall (1960) contains 42 settlement-names containing 'combe' in Somerset, 36 in Devon and 26 in Dorset. The statistic of 36 key names does not give an adequate impression with the use of 'combe' in Devon. She has identified an Old English word 'cumb', meaning 'cup' or 'bowl', which she thinks may well be the origin with the place-na[http://tomsoutletauthentic.net/ toms shoes outlet]me element 'combe', as quite a few from the instances of 'combe' are bowl shaped valleys. Nevertheless, she then admits: "A excellent numerous from the 'combe' names in Devon don't refer to 'cumb' shaped valleys." She attempts to explain this observation by postulating that by the time that the Saxons migrated from Somerset and Dorset into Devon, they had almost certainly forgotten that 'combe' referred to bowl shaped valleys only, so started to apply the name to all valleys. I will leave it to your typical sense to decide regardless of whether such a tortuous explanation has any merit, but as the Celtic word 'combe' (Welsh, 'cwm') refers to most forms of valley (aside from steep sided gorges), this would look to me to become by far one of the most probably explanation for 'combe' names all through the South West. The place-name element 'beer' or 'bere' is actually a addi[http://tomsoutletauthentic.net/ toms outlet]tional tough 1 to pin down. There is certainly certainly an Old English word 'bearu', meaning 'small wood', and this is the derivation normally provided by the so-called place-name specialists. Nonetheless, there is a Celtic word 'ber' which means a promontory, which they only assign 'bere' names to if there is certainly an incredibly clear existence of a promontory and there is absolutely no indication of there ever getting been a tiny wood within the region (like Bere Alston and Bere Ferrers, which both lie on the promontory of land in between the Tamar along with the Tavy rivers). Due to their reluctance to use the Celtic 'ber' derivation, unless forced to complete so, it truly is attainable (if not probable) that you will discover numerous much more instances of 'beer' or 'bere' names in the South West, that are definitely Celtic in origin.<br><br>Plymouth Exile, Looking again at the Road Atlas of Britain, 'combe' certainly does stand out as a widespread location name element in Devon. Anyway, I believe I've a bit of frequent sense however it appears that Margaret Gelling is ready to forfeit some when analysing components of spot names inside the West Nation. As you mentioned DNA tests in your previous message, I was questioning if they took into account pre-saxon invasions, including Beaker Folk or even earlier, which would possibly cause the Saxon element inside the population to seem higher than it seriously is. I realize the survey with the Midlands led by Mark Thomas did take this into account as significantly as possible. But do you know if this was the case with the West Country surveys and Blood of your Vikings? If 20 to 25 % of Devon's population had been Saxon, I would have thought that the Celtic language may perhaps not have survived so long as it did.<br><br>Einion, I have picked up a 1:50,000 scale OS map at random and opened it up at the initial fold. It shows the 65 square mile area bounded by Exeter within the North, Newton Abbot inside the South West and the River Exe inside the East. I have counted each of the location names that are either entirely Celtic (like Dunchideock or Pennycombe) or which include a Celtic root (such as Smallicombe). The total of such Celtic names is 47, of which 19 include the root 'combe' and one consists of the root 'tre'. This provides a rough idea from the density of such names in Devon (total region two,591 square miles). The Blood with the Vikings survey is reported in "A Y Chromosome Census from the British Isles", which can be offered to view on line. It looks at the Y-Chromosome variations, which exist today, with no speculation getting created concerning the genetic composition of pre-Iron Age settlers, which include the Beaker Folk. However, it really is unlikely that any earlier migrants had exactly the same genetic signature as the Saxons; otherwise this would have shown up inside the present day Welsh population. I do not have much details concerning the West Nation surveys, apart from the truth that the general conclusion was drawn that there have been no substantial differences involving the Cornish along with the Devonians. I never see any issue together with the survival in the Brythonic Language on account of the presence of a 25% Saxon element inside the population, as we understand that this was definitely the case in Cornwall. The truth is in Cumbria, the Brythonic Language survived until effectively soon after the Norman Conquest, regardless of the truth that the Y Chromosome census reveals a 40% Germanic element inside the population in that area.<br><br>Hi, everybody, I have been interested in Devon's Celtic past for a lot of years now, and lately posted a couple of contributions around the Celtic Devon thread. An extremely superior resource for placename analysis and effectively as just acquiring your way in regards to the UK, could be the multimap resource at multimap-dot-com. It truly is free of charge to make use of and displays maps down to hamlet and farm level. I recently did a random scan of Devon and identified examples of your surviving Celtic names which have been discussed on this thread, plus two incidences of a hamlet name 'Lana' which may perhaps derive in the old word for church or enclosed land, as in Welsh 'Llan' or the anglicised Devon names Landk[http://www.longchampsale2013.com/ longchamp sale]ey (Church of St Kea), Landcross and Landcove. The name Lana also exists in Cornwall. An additional point to add towards the Celtic placenames debate is that the pre-Saxon Celts of Dumnonia had few identified significant centres of population. The only large spot, Exeter (Isca or Keresk), becoming of course in Devon. Outside of Exeter they seem to possess been a primarily agrarian folks living extensively scattered in really small groups. This reality is represented in the Celtic placenames that survive in Devon today. The good farmland in Devon and lack of all-natural barriers created Devon much more susceptible to Saxon settlement than Cornwall. With Cornwall, the Tamar and the rugged interior acted as a organic brake to further settlement by the English, as did not surprisingly, Norman the Conqueror's invasion! By that point the capital of Cornwall was in the Saxon town of Launceston, in the east of the county, where it remained for centuries afterwards. Devon, in contrast, features a considerably higher quantity of Saxon-era and early medieval settlements, which like their contemporaries in Cornwall-Helston and Launceston-bear either English or anglicised names. Also settlements in Devon generally bear hybrid names, made up of each British and English words, but the bias of placename research constantly provides the English component predominance. Even clearly anglicised Celtic names are attributed solely to English when, as inside the Pennycombe-Penycwm instance cited by Plymouth Exile, or in Cwmbran-Branscombe, the former being a Welsh town, the latter a village in east Devon, the original root is much more probably to possess been the British language. Some say cwm-combe is an English word, later borrowed into Welsh and other Brythonic languages, however the [http://www.tomsoutletfactory.com/ toms outlet store online]other components of each of these names are the exact same in Devon as they're in Wales. As an afterthought I obtain just about the most intriguing Anglo-Saxon placenames of Devon is Stockleigh English, in mid-Devon. Stockleigh English lies close to the region I was brought up in, and I usually wondered why, as we're in England, the village's name should really need to so boldly assert the reality! I not too long ago discovered, just inside the English border with Wales, close to Monmouth, there are two villages called English Bicknor and Welsh Bicknor. Provided that there is certainly likely a absolutely rational standard placename explanation for Stockleigh to declare its Englishness in mid-Devon, with no bringing in 'Wealcyn' or other such mysterious people who should happen to be in Cornwall, I am not going to suggest something additional!<br><br>ExeValleyBoy, You raise an intriguing point regarding the presence of English Bicknor and Welsh Bicknor within the Wye Valley area. There is also the pair of villages in Shropshire known as English Frankton and Welsh Frankton, which are also close for the Welsh border. As outlined by "Celtic Voices English Places" by Richard Coates and Andrew Breeze, significantly with the region close for the Welsh border was Welsh speaking territory up until comparatively modern day occasions, this being reflected in the substantial number of Welsh place-names thereabouts. It truly is therefore almost specific that these names arose in an effort to distinguish between English and Welsh speaking settlements in the exact same name. Regarding the name Stockleigh English in Devon, there is absolutely no balancing 'Stockleigh Welsh' or 'Stockleigh Cornish' name. One could thus conjecture that it acquired the 'English' element to recognize an location where a group of English (Saxon) settlers lived amongst a predominantly indigenous British population. I can think about no other explanation why the appellation 'English' would have already been added, and this explanation would tie in together with the Welsh border instances. I've observed the contention that the Welsh word 'cwm' was a borrowed English word, on a preceding occasion, but not in any serious place-name study, exactly where it really is generally stated that the borrowing is within the other direction. Even Margaret Gelling, who has postulated that most of the English 'combe' names are derived from an old English word for bowl or cup, admits that there is a genuine Brythonic word 'cumm' or 'cumb' (valley), that is noticed inside the Welsh 'cwm'. I think that if 'cwm' had been a word borrowed from English, 1 would anticipate to view lots of more situations of its usage in Welsh regions close towards the border with England, but this really is not the case, since it [http://tomsoutletstoreonline.com/ toms outlet store]observed often all more than Wales. There is a further feasible derivation with the name 'Branscombe', aside from it being the equivalent of the Welsh 'Cwmbran' (Valley of crows). It could be St. Brannock's Valley, but this is almost certainly significantly less probably as the influence of St. Brannock was a lot more apparent in North Devon about Braunton, than in South East Devon.<br><br>ExeValleyBoy, While Exeter/Keresk could have already been the only town or city in Devon in pre-Saxon occasions, it was not the only settlement. I can think about two with Celtic links with respect to name. Newton Abbot seems quintessentially English in nomenclature, however the region was also called 'Penn'. A road junction for the west of Newton Abbot nonetheless bears this name. Possibly this represents two settlements - a single Saxon one particular Celtic - that eventually merged, or perhaps two unique names existed for the identical town - once again suggesting some survival of Briton speakers in the area. The other one that springs to thoughts is Barnstaple, which is recorded as being founded by the Saxons, and however can also be recognized by the Celto-Roman name of Barum to locals. Possibly this was the name of a native settlement that became enveloped inside the developing town, or probably it was the name with the region (as opposed to the town). The fact that in all 3 circumstances (Exeter/Newton Abbott/Barnstaple)it was the English name which came to be accepted almost certainly reflects the social dominance of your English language. [By this I refer towards the theory as to why the Britons appear to have adopted the English language while DNA proof suggests they remain the biggest percentage on the population. Basically this states that the English language progressively became noticed to become observed of superior status. Whilst lots of Britons would have continued to speak Celtic amongst themselves over time (and in Devon's case this was centuries) the Celtic usage dwindled into disuse].<br><br>Although many Anglo-Saxonists appear keen to deny it, the truth remains that a conquered population imposing their language
 
A Conversation for CELTIC DEVON<br><br>I am hopeful that this discussion will move across to H2G2 - I realize that BBC Devon are hoping to achieve this. However - just in case this discussion 'freezes' I believed I'd inform all that there is certainly a Devon Celtic Language web-site about to be launched. This might have already been the language of the legendary King Arthur. It was absolutely the 'common ancestor' of contemporary day Breton and Cornish languages. The language has been recreated by way of a handbook by linguist Joseph Biddulph and this web site will deliver an extremely very brief taste of it, in addition to a opportunity to study additional. It will be great to view this ancient language resurrected. 2 Cornish for Devonians. We know the Celtic language survived in Devon for some time after the period above. As far as I can inform the Cornish language (itself a resurrection via a handbook published by Jenner a century ago) may be the closest we can get to what Devon's language was. The site will give a link to (some significantly less political) Cornish language sources as well as a chance to join a forum exactly where you do not must pretend you will be Cornish! three Devon Celtic placenames four Devons Celtic Saints. All this can be complementary[http://cheaptomsshoeoutlet.net/ cheap toms shoes] for the discussions that (hopeully) will continue right here on the 'Celtic Devon' web site (wherever that ends up getting). In reality - if this surives it will be a[http://tomsoutletshoes.net/ toms shoes] great forum to talk about these issues!!<br><br>Hello everyone, hope you remember me from the devon flag campaign! glad to determine the forum is alive and nicely. seeking at all of the stuff you could now obtain with the Devon flag on it, it appears it was all worth the tough work. the discussion on language and celtic survival is good, i've seriously enjoyed reading it. I was so angry in the guy in the celtic league demanding that Mr. Flag take the flag in the list of celtic nations/regions that i wanted him to know he was behaving like a nazi, one particular man deciding who was and who wasn't allowed inside the 'club'. Anyway normally down in axemouth flying the flag on my dad's boat and finding a great deal of interest(even an old sea-dog form standing up and saluting it!) each of the greatest London Devonish<br><br>London Devonish - the return on the prodigal son! Excellent to hear that the Devon Flag continues to be flying in Axemouth! You refer to a member on the Celtic League asking to take down the Devon Flag in the list of Celtic nations/regions. Exactly where or when was this? Have I missed some thing or am I going senile (rather possible). The only issue I can recall is some Cornish dude (or three) getting angry about the mention - and Mr Flag did alter the words - slightly. Absolutely Mr Flag's web page still has the Devon Flag below the 'Celtic' nations section.<br><br>Ozzie Exile, I think that it was the irate Cornish Nationalist who London Devonish was referring to, as he stated that he will be raising the matter using the Celtic League in the time. As we have received no stern warnings (joke) from the Celtic League about our flag, I can only assume that the Celtic League treated his plea using the contempt it deserved. I've identified in my dealings with persons in the other Celtic regions that they think the Cornish Nationalist extremists are total cranks, just as considerably as we do. Incidentally, talking of cranks, a certain Nick person has turned up at the Gesithas website and has started to possess a go at us again. I'm concocting a single of my put-downs for him at the moment. London Devonish, Great to hear from you once again. Have you visited Ozzie Exile's "Devon's Celtic language" website yet, that is just receiving started. We could do with some fresh input. Plymouth Exile<br><br>Einion, "Place Names of Devon" states that less than 1% of Devon place names are Celtic in origin. You'll find two key reasons for this statement. Firstly, PN Devon only lists key location names, and the majority of the Celtic names in Devon are minor names of compact hamlets and farmsteads. It can be mostly the names of towns and bigger villages that a single sees on most maps that show both Devon and Cornwall, so the difference among the two counties is a lot more apparent at this scale (PN Devon lists only 3 'tre' names at this scale, whereas you can find no less than thirty). Secondly, PN Devon assumes that just about all names containing roots which include 'combe', 'dun', 'tor', 'pol', 'cors', and so on. are English names as they assume that these Celtic words had been borrowed into English. As Devon is complete of places with names containing these roots (specially 'combe'), this assumption reduces the supposed number of Celtic (or partly Celtic) names drastically. The histories in the Devon towns differ from those in Cornwall. In Devon, a number of towns grew up throughout the boom in woollen manufacture in the 14th and 15th centuries, at a time when the Brythonic language was either dead, or in decline. Consequently, these woollen business towns acquired English names. There was no such woollen boom in Cornwall. Right here, the smaller s[http://tomsoutletauthentic.net/ toms shoes outlet]ized towns and the vil[http://www.longchampsale2013.com/ long champ]lages have been settlements, which grew from tiny farmsteads or hamlets and these retained their original Cornish names. That is why a number of Cornish towns and villages have names beginning with 'Tre' (meaning 'farmstead'), since that may be what they initially had been. Returning to the names in Devon containing the 'combe', 'tor', 'dun' and so on. elements, I really feel that the 'borrowed' explanation is no longer tenable. This theory was introduced in Victorian instances when it was fashionable to believe that the Britons didn't survive the Anglo-Saxon invasion/settlement outside of Wales and Cornwall, so some explanation had to be given for the apparently substantial quantity of Celtic spot names in counties for example Devon. Now that we know for specific (from DNA surveys) that the descendents of the Britons (Celts) considerably outnumber the descendents from the Saxons inside the entire from the South West (not just Cornwall), the 'borrowed' explanation loses it credibility. Are we expected to believe that a comparatively compact number of Saxons settled in Devon and renamed the houses of all of the Britons, who have been currently living there, and named their own houses, making use of 'borrowed' Celtic names, and yet continued to speak their very own language? Add to this the observation that several names containing the element 'pen', which are clearly Celtic in origin, which include 'Pennycombe' (close to Exeter) have been ascribed as possessing an English derivation (which means 'enclosure inside the valley), in lieu of the considerably additional clear Celtic derivation (which means 'head with the valley'), which precisely describes its location. Once again we see the assumption that 'pen' would be the English word for enclosure and 'combe' can be a 'borrowed' word and consequently also English. How do they explain the equivalent Welsh name 'Penycwm' near St. Davids in Wales? I bet they would not claim it to be English.<br><br>Plymouth Exile, It makes sense that the boom inside the woollen industry can be a massive factor in the distinction of place names between Devon and Cornwall, that is a thing I had'nt definitely thought of. Would it be the comparative hilliness of Devon which caused such a boom in wool? I've noticed that north-west Cornwall has much more Devon-style names, which, going by the technique of roads etc., is additional hilly than the rest of Cornwall (I am from Australia by the way, so I primarily know Devon and Cornwall by maps and photos). Do you know of anywhere online I could view a smaller sized scale map of Devon which includes farmsteads and hamlets? The concept that the Saxons decided to borrow a lot of additional Celtic names in Devon and also the west than elsewhere in England is indicative of your great lengths some people are prepared to go to in help of their pet concepts; it's practically laughable to feel (and realise!) that some historians take the concept seriously. Speaking of such suggestions, I think I've heard it stated that the prefix 'beer' (as in Beercrocombe) is of Saxon origin. It seems to become virtually exclusively confined for the south-western peninsula of Britain, so I have wondered whether or not it is actually basically of Celtic origin. Would that be a appropriate assumption?<br><br>Einion, I had a rapid search on-line, but I couldn't locate any maps of Devon, which show detail down to person farms. To obtain an precise impression with the place-name components employed for farms and hamlets, there isn't any substitute for the GB Ordnance Survey 1:50,000 and 1:25,000 series maps. Having said that in her book "The Landscape of Place-Names", Margaret Gelling states: "Combe is a lot far more prevalent in South West England than in any other area. Ekwall (1960) contains 42 settlement-names containing 'combe' in Somerset, 36 in Devon and 26 in Dorset. The statistic of 36 key names does not give an adequate impression with the use of 'combe' in Devon. She has identified an Old English word 'cumb', meaning 'cup' or 'bowl', which she thinks may well be the origin with the place-na[http://tomsoutletauthentic.net/ toms shoes outlet]me element 'combe', as quite a few from the instances of 'combe' are bowl shaped valleys. Nevertheless, she then admits: "A excellent numerous from the 'combe' names in Devon don't refer to 'cumb' shaped valleys." She attempts to explain this observation by postulating that by the time that the Saxons migrated from Somerset and Dorset into Devon, they had almost certainly forgotten that 'combe' referred to bowl shaped valleys only, so started to apply the name to all valleys. I will leave it to your typical sense to decide regardless of whether such a tortuous explanation has any merit, but as the Celtic word 'combe' (Welsh, 'cwm') refers to most forms of valley (aside from steep sided gorges), this would look to me to become by far one of the most probably explanation for 'combe' names all through the South West. The place-name element 'beer' or 'bere' is actually a addi[http://tomsoutletauthentic.net/ toms outlet]tional tough 1 to pin down. There is certainly certainly an Old English word 'bearu', meaning 'small wood', and this is the derivation normally provided by the so-called place-name specialists. Nonetheless, there is a Celtic word 'ber' which means a promontory, which they only assign 'bere' names to if there is certainly an incredibly clear existence of a promontory and there is absolutely no indication of there ever getting been a tiny wood within the region (like Bere Alston and Bere Ferrers, which both lie on the promontory of land in between the Tamar along with the Tavy rivers). Due to their reluctance to use the Celtic 'ber' derivation, unless forced to complete so, it truly is attainable (if not probable) that you will discover numerous much more instances of 'beer' or 'bere' names in the South West, that are definitely Celtic in origin.<br><br>Plymouth Exile, Looking again at the Road Atlas of Britain, 'combe' certainly does stand out as a widespread location name element in Devon. Anyway, I believe I've a bit of frequent sense however it appears that Margaret Gelling is ready to forfeit some when analysing components of spot names inside the West Nation. As you mentioned DNA tests in your previous message, I was questioning if they took into account pre-saxon invasions, including Beaker Folk or even earlier, which would possibly cause the Saxon element inside the population to seem higher than it seriously is. I realize the survey with the Midlands led by Mark Thomas did take this into account as significantly as possible. But do you know if this was the case with the West Country surveys and Blood of your Vikings? If 20 to 25 % of Devon's population had been Saxon, I would have thought that the Celtic language may perhaps not have survived so long as it did.<br><br>Einion, I have picked up a 1:50,000 scale OS map at random and opened it up at the initial fold. It shows the 65 square mile area bounded by Exeter within the North, Newton Abbot inside the South West and the River Exe inside the East. I have counted each of the location names that are either entirely Celtic (like Dunchideock or Pennycombe) or which include a Celtic root (such as Smallicombe). The total of such Celtic names is 47, of which 19 include the root 'combe' and one consists of the root 'tre'. This provides a rough idea from the density of such names in Devon (total region two,591 square miles). The Blood with the Vikings survey is reported in "A Y Chromosome Census from the British Isles", which can be offered to view on line. It looks at the Y-Chromosome variations, which exist today, with no speculation getting created concerning the genetic composition of pre-Iron Age settlers, which include the Beaker Folk. However, it really is unlikely that any earlier migrants had exactly the same genetic signature as the Saxons; otherwise this would have shown up inside the present day Welsh population. I do not have much details concerning the West Nation surveys, apart from the truth that the general conclusion was drawn that there have been no substantial differences involving the Cornish along with the Devonians. I never see any issue together with the survival in the Brythonic Language on account of the presence of a 25% Saxon element inside the population, as we understand that this was definitely the case in Cornwall. The truth is in Cumbria, the Brythonic Language survived until effectively soon after the Norman Conquest, regardless of the truth that the Y Chromosome census reveals a 40% Germanic element inside the population in that area.<br><br>Hi, everybody, I have been interested in Devon's Celtic past for a lot of years now, and lately posted a couple of contributions around the Celtic Devon thread. An extremely superior resource for placename analysis and effectively as just acquiring your way in regards to the UK, could be the multimap resource at multimap-dot-com. It truly is free of charge to make use of and displays maps down to hamlet and farm level. I recently did a random scan of Devon and identified examples of your surviving Celtic names which have been discussed on this thread, plus two incidences of a hamlet name 'Lana' which may perhaps derive in the old word for church or enclosed land, as in Welsh 'Llan' or the anglicised Devon names Landk[http://www.longchampsale2013.com/ longchamp sale]ey (Church of St Kea), Landcross and Landcove. The name Lana also exists in Cornwall. An additional point to add towards the Celtic placenames debate is that the pre-Saxon Celts of Dumnonia had few identified significant centres of population. The only large spot, Exeter (Isca or Keresk), becoming of course in Devon. Outside of Exeter they seem to possess been a primarily agrarian folks living extensively scattered in really small groups. This reality is represented in the Celtic placenames that survive in Devon today. The good farmland in Devon and lack of all-natural barriers created Devon much more susceptible to Saxon settlement than Cornwall. With Cornwall, the Tamar and the rugged interior acted as a organic brake to further settlement by the English, as did not surprisingly, Norman the Conqueror's invasion! By that point the capital of Cornwall was in the Saxon town of Launceston, in the east of the county, where it remained for centuries afterwards. Devon, in contrast, features a considerably higher quantity of Saxon-era and early medieval settlements, which like their contemporaries in Cornwall-Helston and Launceston-bear either English or anglicised names. Also settlements in Devon generally bear hybrid names, made up of each British and English words, but the bias of placename research constantly provides the English component predominance. Even clearly anglicised Celtic names are attributed solely to English when, as inside the Pennycombe-Penycwm instance cited by Plymouth Exile, or in Cwmbran-Branscombe, the former being a Welsh town, the latter a village in east Devon, the original root is much more probably to possess been the British language. Some say cwm-combe is an English word, later borrowed into Welsh and other Brythonic languages, however the [http://www.tomsoutletfactory.com/ toms outlet store online]other components of each of these names are the exact same in Devon as they're in Wales. As an afterthought I obtain just about the most intriguing Anglo-Saxon placenames of Devon is Stockleigh English, in mid-Devon. Stockleigh English lies close to the region I was brought up in, and I usually wondered why, as we're in England, the village's name should really need to so boldly assert the reality! I not too long ago discovered, just inside the English border with Wales, close to Monmouth, there are two villages called English Bicknor and Welsh Bicknor. Provided that there is certainly likely a absolutely rational standard placename explanation for Stockleigh to declare its Englishness in mid-Devon, with no bringing in 'Wealcyn' or other such mysterious people who should happen to be in Cornwall, I am not going to suggest something additional!<br><br>ExeValleyBoy, You raise an intriguing point regarding the presence of English Bicknor and Welsh Bicknor within the Wye Valley area. There is also the pair of villages in Shropshire known as English Frankton and Welsh Frankton, which are also close for the Welsh border. As outlined by "Celtic Voices English Places" by Richard Coates and Andrew Breeze, significantly with the region close for the Welsh border was Welsh speaking territory up until comparatively modern day occasions, this being reflected in the substantial number of Welsh place-names thereabouts. It truly is therefore almost specific that these names arose in an effort to distinguish between English and Welsh speaking settlements in the exact same name. Regarding the name Stockleigh English in Devon, there is absolutely no balancing 'Stockleigh Welsh' or 'Stockleigh Cornish' name. One could thus conjecture that it acquired the 'English' element to recognize an location where a group of English (Saxon) settlers lived amongst a predominantly indigenous British population. I can think about no other explanation why the appellation 'English' would have already been added, and this explanation would tie in together with the Welsh border instances. I've observed the contention that the Welsh word 'cwm' was a borrowed English word, on a preceding occasion, but not in any serious place-name study, exactly where it really is generally stated that the borrowing is within the other direction. Even Margaret Gelling, who has postulated that most of the English 'combe' names are derived from an old English word for bowl or cup, admits that there is a genuine Brythonic word 'cumm' or 'cumb' (valley), that is noticed inside the Welsh 'cwm'. I think that if 'cwm' had been a word borrowed from English, 1 would anticipate to view lots of more situations of its usage in Welsh regions close towards the border with England, but this really is not the case, since it [http://tomsoutletstoreonline.com/ toms outlet store]observed often all more than Wales. There is a further feasible derivation with the name 'Branscombe', aside from it being the equivalent of the Welsh 'Cwmbran' (Valley of crows). It could be St. Brannock's Valley, but this is almost certainly significantly less probably as the influence of St. Brannock was a lot more apparent in North Devon about Braunton, than in South East Devon.<br><br>ExeValleyBoy, While Exeter/Keresk could have already been the only town or city in Devon in pre-Saxon occasions, it was not the only settlement. I can think about two with Celtic links with respect to name. Newton Abbot seems quintessentially English in nomenclature, however the region was also called 'Penn'. A road junction for the west of Newton Abbot nonetheless bears this name. Possibly this represents two settlements - a single Saxon one particular Celtic - that eventually merged, or perhaps two unique names existed for the identical town - once again suggesting some survival of Briton speakers in the area. The other one that springs to thoughts is Barnstaple, which is recorded as being founded by the Saxons, and however can also be recognized by the Celto-Roman name of Barum to locals. Possibly this was the name of a native settlement that became enveloped inside the developing town, or probably it was the name with the region (as opposed to the town). The fact that in all 3 circumstances (Exeter/Newton Abbott/Barnstaple)it was the English name which came to be accepted almost certainly reflects the social dominance of your English language. [By this I refer towards the theory as to why the Britons appear to have adopted the English language while DNA proof suggests they remain the biggest percentage on the population. Basically this states that the English language progressively became noticed to become observed of superior status. Whilst lots of Britons would have continued to speak Celtic amongst themselves over time (and in Devon's case this was centuries) the Celtic usage dwindled into disuse].<br><br>Although many Anglo-Saxonists appear keen to deny it, the truth remains that a conquered population imposing their language
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== a book to movie review of Time Traveler Wife-spun2 ==
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a book to movie overview of Time Traveler Wife<br><br>Possibly I having softer with age, it is pretty possible mainly because my budd[http://tomsoutletstoreonline.com/ toms outlet store]y who commonly loves [http://www.longchampsale2013.com/ longchamp sale]romance film[http://www.cheaptomsshoe.biz/ cheap toms shoes]s hated Time Traveler Wife whilst I walked out from the theater getting enchanted by the story. Genera[http://tomsoutletshoes.net/ toms shoes]lly I despise romantic movies and keep away from them like some mass media warned pandemic, but I was sold on [http://www.tomsoutletfactory.net/ toms outlet]this film when I saw Rachel McAdams on Each day Show producing a muddle of her interview with Jon Stewart. She mentioned just enough, even though giving away the majority of the plot, that I believed the flick could be worth my time. Is it sappy? You bet. Is it the kind of love story that has in no way been told before? Yes inside a good way, and no in a predictable Story kind of way.<br><br>Depending on the 2003 novel by Audrey Niffenegger of y[http://tomsoutletshoes.net/ toms shoes outlet]our very same name, th[http://tomsoutletstoreonline.com/ toms outlet store]e story revolves around Henry (Eric Bana) who includes a genetic disorder that causes him to travel by way of time. He 1st meets Clare (McAdams) though he is functioning as a librarian and she recognizes him although he has no thought who she is. She tells him that she knows about his condition, which not merely causes him to vanish but to reappear at some other time without having a stitch of clothes. Therefore it can be safe to say that consistent relationships aren definitely his point except he finds it incredible that an individual is capable to accept him as he's.<br><br>My friend thought the time traveling premise didn fulfill the criteria for suitable suspension of disbelief, but I believed it did. Immediately after all, he[http://tomsoutletshoes.net/ toms shoes outlet] does go to a medical professional who wins some significant medical science prize for the discovery from the situation, but all round I consider it truly is the chemistry among the each likeable McAdams and Bana that really tends to make this film perform for me. The time traveling element alterations this romantic f[http://www.tomsoutletfactory.net/ toms outlet]ilm from being just an additional r[http://www.longchampsale2013.com/ long champ]un from the mill romantic flick to being anything that transcends the genre not within the case of my pal. I actually didn thoughts that Bana would from time to time have conversations with younger or older versions of himself or that he meets his future wife when she is just a child obtaining a picnic by herself (okay that may possibly be pushing the suspension of disbelief a little due to the fact most young children don pack picnics for themselves).<br><br>Time Traveler Wife isn necessarily a film a single have to rush out to view. It can make for a excellent DVD viewing or cable. I give it valuable pink manicured thumbs up.Related articles:
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A few Strategies for Dealing with a Challenging Boss Tip

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RSS for Karl's articles - Go to Karl's website

Karl spent his childhood within the Los Angeles metro region. Then his loved ones moved to Zurich, Switzerland and Karl lived in Europe just before returning to Del Mar, San Diego, CA. Following promoting their home in Rancho Santa Fe, San Diego, CA and also a one year long road trip with his wife, three teenagers and their puppy within a Motor-Home they settled down on Padre Island, Corpus Christi, TX aroutoms outlet storend the Gulf of Mexico. Right after yet another long RV Trip Karl and his wife Ursula now reside on their Ranch in Texas although their three grown young children have left the nest to find fame and fortune in Austin, TX. Karl's 35+ years of enterprise encounter in numerous high-, low and bio-tech industries ranges from blue collar positions as machine shop operator, electronic cheap tomsengineer, and appmichael kors canadalication developer; and white color positions within the corporate arenas of sales, advertising and marketing, consulting, management, and executive positions. He holds many degrees intoms outlet store Mechanics, Electronics, Enterpristoms outlet onlinee Technologies, Computer software Engineering, Operations and Company Administration and has held positions in quite a few industries which includes Electronics, Pc Manufacturing, Software Development, Enterprise Technology, Retail, Bio-Tech Pharmaceutical, High-Tech, Defense, Telecommunication, and RADAR. This special blend of knowledge has helped him to create an appreciation for perform, projects and company "on each sides from the fence". Soon after a extended and very profitable career within the corporate arena as a C-level etoms shoes outletxecutive Karl opened his qualified coaching and consulting practice to live an genuine life with much more time for his wife and children.Related articles:

A a great deal additional crucial trigger a boots-spun1

A a terrific deal extra critical trigger a boots

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A Conversation for I Couldn't Care Less-spun8

A Conversation for I Couldn't Care Much less

Hi once again Benjamin What you are speaking is just not depression. Generally toms shoes outletfolks say they're feelicheap toms shoesng they are feeling depressed, after they are feeling sad or low nevertheless it is not truly depression. Whenever you are depressed is mind numbingly hard to get by way of even simple tasks or not attainable. At its most serious people commit suicide. Depression can't just be overcome by going out and performing one thing socially beneficial. Some people can overcome it by pro-actively changing or focusing on their lifestyle,exercising, reducing alcohol intake or carrying out activities that improve self esteem and self-assurance and give a sense of purpose. But there's no 'just' in that. For other folks, it is actually either a lot more serious, or they obtain far more complicated and it can require medication or talking therapy, and possibly also adjustments in life style. External pressures possess a aspect to play in depression, including long periods of tension and insecurity, a traumatic life event or losing your job. Given the financial and social pressures that there are presently, they are likely to influence rates of depression, I'll punt on a rise in persons suffering and that would be a sign in the occasions. It really is significant to define depression because the mental illness that it really is and like all mental illnesses these weren't understood historically and remain misunderstood these days Peanut

I just want to say anything . depression is not generally clinical decheap toms shoespression. Depression just indicates possessing a low mood, and ctoms outlet storean be quite mild. It's not necessarily a psychiatric disorder. Clinical depression is often a certain issue, and you wlong champill discover other psychiatric circumstances which function depression as one of their aspects. I'd say depression as a mood can unquestionably be countered in many ways; you will find also components within the lives of those that can trigger main clinical depression. You'll find issues that we are able to do to create ourselves and each other happier and much more happy and that kan support keep us on an even keel. There are approaches in which to prevent critical mental illness. There are approaches to 'treat' mild or even full-blown mental illness also, brief of/in addition to drug therapy.

Ben, I am sorry that was a lecture, not one particular you necessary. I identified it little tough to detangle your trains of thought. You might be right that activities can possess a function to play in prevention. At times I've been capable to view items coming and been within a spot where I can do that. Other occasions it sneaks up and all of a sudden boom, that you are floored. Also undoubtedly they've a function to play in recovery Countless aspects come into play, the severity, just how much you as a person have in reserve, the assistance netwotoms outletrks you have got and practical experience, for some people it may be a 1 off, for other people for other it might be a reoccuring factor. I know, preaching towards the converttoms outlet storeed One final issue, I'm going mention just for a little moan. Flipping hormones might be suitable evil small blighters

I do really know you did not it need to have as a lecture and am aware I that I ought to have been a lot more sensitive to that in the time of posting. I know that my points are fair but I still think I could have tried tougher to detangle exactly where *you* coming from with respect to that a single unique report. Context Peanut! For that I'm sorry. I am not certain how much I subscribe towards the idea of not truly realizing due to the fact you haven't skilled some thing , empathy, understanding, listening, that capability to truly place oneself in somebody elses shoes goes a lengthy way. I feel you do that. And supporting and caring for someone has it personal demands, I know these also and have a substantial respect for that and for people like you, who present that assistance as aspect of a loving and caring relmichael kors outletationship. I hope that I have expressed the above paragraph right, I'm conscious on the reality that niether youlongchamp sale, nor Raven, would want your connection defined as certainly one of 'carer and caree' Peanut

Yes - a difficult situation indeed. When I was unemployed, I did a couple of days' formal volunteering furthermore to informal volunteering as well as other day to day factors along with my weekly trip to the jobcentre and all the time I spent on job applications, but the sheer grind of rejection right after rejection in jobhunting was still enough to threaten my mental health. In the point exactly where I had almost offered up hope of ever being employable for actual cash, I really received an acceptance, so that boosted me away from my inner darkness. I'm much more conscious of my personal mental well being now, though, as even getting withtoms shoesin a job is no guarantee of keeping the inner darkness at bay.Related articles:

A Day Out in Munnar-spun10

A day Out in Munnar

Munnar, which means confluence of 3 rivers, was the summer season resort from the toms shoeserstwhile British rulers inside the colonial days. Sharp planted the initial tea bush longchamp saleand because then tea has been the key agricultural crop within the area. Now, the hills around Muntoms outletnar are blanketed with best-in-class green tea bushes. With its sprawling tea plantations, pristine valleys and mountains and cool air, it really is no surprise that Munnar has toms outletbeen rated the second-best Asian travel destination for 2010.

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On the strategy to Munnar, some 22 kms before reaching there, I stopped by Anayirankal dam, a vast expanse of water surrounded by green carpeted hills covered with tea gardens. The distant view of the reservoir follows you for an additional 15 kms and it's a great place for photography.

The dude who poses here is Varayadu or Nilgiri Tahr, stocky goats with short, coarse fur as well as a bristly mane. Nilgiri Tahr is definitely an endangered mountain ungulate listed in schedule I with the Indian Wildlife (Protection) Act 1972. Eravikulam National Park which has the highest density and biggest surviving population of this species is situated hardly 14 kms from Munnar town. Know extra about this endangered species.

Dotoms outletes this picture recommend land's end? It practically is. That is Top Station, which is 41 kms uphill from Munnar. Situated at the border of Kerala and Tamilnadu, this spot presents an 'awebreathtakingsome' panoramic view. Strolling down this pathway with steep abyss on both sides is adventurous, rather risky, but the view you get there is among a kind.

At each other corner you are going to obtain females with baskets full of locally grown fruits and vegetables. Never overlook to bargain and obtain tender carrots, passion fruits and wild tomatoes, all farm fresh and scrumptious.

Anamudi will be the highest peak within the Western Ghats situated at a height of two,695 metres (8,842 feet) above imply sea level. It is located in the southern a part of Eravikulam National Park, fifty kilometers from Munnar. It is also the best spot for wildlife travelers and nature lovers. It actually means "Elephant forehead".

13 kms away from Munnar, Mattupetty is famous for its extremely specialised dairy farm, the Indo-Swiss project. More than one hundred varieties of high yielding cattle are reared here. The Mattupetty Lake and Dam, just a brief distance in the farm, is a michael kors outletbeautiful picnic spot. The sprawling Kundala tea plantations, Kundala Lake plus the echo point are other toms outlet store onlineattractions in the vicinity. A boat cruise on the lake may be the very best way to love the leisure.

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A class of its own-spun1

A class of its personal

The mark of a genuine man lies inside the make of his suit.

THEY say the mark of a gentleman is definitely the high-quality of his suit. Not a single to bow towards the most recent trends, the gentleman is one particular who sticks to classics like a badge of distinction. That is definitely the philosophy of Italian luxury label Canali.

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George Clooney searching suave inside a Canali inside the film Michael Clayton.

In the core in the brand is its craftmanship as well as the label has remained committed to high quality.

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Canali, he adds, is concerning the niche consumer, the a single who understands high quality, and this incorporates folks who are specialists, businessmen and entrepreneurs.

Paolo Canali: 'Our strength is the fact that we're all about premium quality.'

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The enterprise was founded in 1934, when brothers Giovanni and Giacomo Canali founded a tailoring workshop devoted to the manufacture of top quality clothing. Now, the brand is readily available at 1,000 locations all through the world such as Milan, Paris, Tokyo, Beijing and now, Kuala Lumpur.

The duplex shop in Pavilion provides customers a full array of made-to-order and ready-to-wear suit collections, shirts, trousers andtoms shoes outlet accessories like footwear, belts, ties and cufflinks.

A ctoms outlet storerucial element on the brand is that it remains true to its tradition. Regardless of its fast expansion, the items continue to be manufactured in Italy and all its tailoring is still lovingly created by hand. Every day, the company's 1,600 employees generate some 1,400 suits and 1,600 trousers.

"It is 100% made in Italy at our personal factories," explains Paolo, who is the third generation to be involved in the organization.

The Canali flagship store at Pavilion Kuala Lumpur delivers a full selection of items.

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A Conversation for CELTIC DEVON-spun2

A Conversation for CELTIC DEVON

I am hopeful that this discussion will move across to H2G2 - I realize that BBC Devon are hoping to achieve this. However - just in case this discussion 'freezes' I believed I'd inform all that there is certainly a Devon Celtic Language web-site about to be launched. This might have already been the language of the legendary King Arthur. It was absolutely the 'common ancestor' of contemporary day Breton and Cornish languages. The language has been recreated by way of a handbook by linguist Joseph Biddulph and this web site will deliver an extremely very brief taste of it, in addition to a opportunity to study additional. It will be great to view this ancient language resurrected. 2 Cornish for Devonians. We know the Celtic language survived in Devon for some time after the period above. As far as I can inform the Cornish language (itself a resurrection via a handbook published by Jenner a century ago) may be the closest we can get to what Devon's language was. The site will give a link to (some significantly less political) Cornish language sources as well as a chance to join a forum exactly where you do not must pretend you will be Cornish! three Devon Celtic placenames four Devons Celtic Saints. All this can be complementarycheap toms shoes for the discussions that (hopeully) will continue right here on the 'Celtic Devon' web site (wherever that ends up getting). In reality - if this surives it will be atoms shoes great forum to talk about these issues!!

Hello everyone, hope you remember me from the devon flag campaign! glad to determine the forum is alive and nicely. seeking at all of the stuff you could now obtain with the Devon flag on it, it appears it was all worth the tough work. the discussion on language and celtic survival is good, i've seriously enjoyed reading it. I was so angry in the guy in the celtic league demanding that Mr. Flag take the flag in the list of celtic nations/regions that i wanted him to know he was behaving like a nazi, one particular man deciding who was and who wasn't allowed inside the 'club'. Anyway normally down in axemouth flying the flag on my dad's boat and finding a great deal of interest(even an old sea-dog form standing up and saluting it!) each of the greatest London Devonish

London Devonish - the return on the prodigal son! Excellent to hear that the Devon Flag continues to be flying in Axemouth! You refer to a member on the Celtic League asking to take down the Devon Flag in the list of Celtic nations/regions. Exactly where or when was this? Have I missed some thing or am I going senile (rather possible). The only issue I can recall is some Cornish dude (or three) getting angry about the mention - and Mr Flag did alter the words - slightly. Absolutely Mr Flag's web page still has the Devon Flag below the 'Celtic' nations section.

Ozzie Exile, I think that it was the irate Cornish Nationalist who London Devonish was referring to, as he stated that he will be raising the matter using the Celtic League in the time. As we have received no stern warnings (joke) from the Celtic League about our flag, I can only assume that the Celtic League treated his plea using the contempt it deserved. I've identified in my dealings with persons in the other Celtic regions that they think the Cornish Nationalist extremists are total cranks, just as considerably as we do. Incidentally, talking of cranks, a certain Nick person has turned up at the Gesithas website and has started to possess a go at us again. I'm concocting a single of my put-downs for him at the moment. London Devonish, Great to hear from you once again. Have you visited Ozzie Exile's "Devon's Celtic language" website yet, that is just receiving started. We could do with some fresh input. Plymouth Exile

Einion, "Place Names of Devon" states that less than 1% of Devon place names are Celtic in origin. You'll find two key reasons for this statement. Firstly, PN Devon only lists key location names, and the majority of the Celtic names in Devon are minor names of compact hamlets and farmsteads. It can be mostly the names of towns and bigger villages that a single sees on most maps that show both Devon and Cornwall, so the difference among the two counties is a lot more apparent at this scale (PN Devon lists only 3 'tre' names at this scale, whereas you can find no less than thirty). Secondly, PN Devon assumes that just about all names containing roots which include 'combe', 'dun', 'tor', 'pol', 'cors', and so on. are English names as they assume that these Celtic words had been borrowed into English. As Devon is complete of places with names containing these roots (specially 'combe'), this assumption reduces the supposed number of Celtic (or partly Celtic) names drastically. The histories in the Devon towns differ from those in Cornwall. In Devon, a number of towns grew up throughout the boom in woollen manufacture in the 14th and 15th centuries, at a time when the Brythonic language was either dead, or in decline. Consequently, these woollen business towns acquired English names. There was no such woollen boom in Cornwall. Right here, the smaller stoms shoes outletized towns and the villong champlages have been settlements, which grew from tiny farmsteads or hamlets and these retained their original Cornish names. That is why a number of Cornish towns and villages have names beginning with 'Tre' (meaning 'farmstead'), since that may be what they initially had been. Returning to the names in Devon containing the 'combe', 'tor', 'dun' and so on. elements, I really feel that the 'borrowed' explanation is no longer tenable. This theory was introduced in Victorian instances when it was fashionable to believe that the Britons didn't survive the Anglo-Saxon invasion/settlement outside of Wales and Cornwall, so some explanation had to be given for the apparently substantial quantity of Celtic spot names in counties for example Devon. Now that we know for specific (from DNA surveys) that the descendents of the Britons (Celts) considerably outnumber the descendents from the Saxons inside the entire from the South West (not just Cornwall), the 'borrowed' explanation loses it credibility. Are we expected to believe that a comparatively compact number of Saxons settled in Devon and renamed the houses of all of the Britons, who have been currently living there, and named their own houses, making use of 'borrowed' Celtic names, and yet continued to speak their very own language? Add to this the observation that several names containing the element 'pen', which are clearly Celtic in origin, which include 'Pennycombe' (close to Exeter) have been ascribed as possessing an English derivation (which means 'enclosure inside the valley), in lieu of the considerably additional clear Celtic derivation (which means 'head with the valley'), which precisely describes its location. Once again we see the assumption that 'pen' would be the English word for enclosure and 'combe' can be a 'borrowed' word and consequently also English. How do they explain the equivalent Welsh name 'Penycwm' near St. Davids in Wales? I bet they would not claim it to be English.

Plymouth Exile, It makes sense that the boom inside the woollen industry can be a massive factor in the distinction of place names between Devon and Cornwall, that is a thing I had'nt definitely thought of. Would it be the comparative hilliness of Devon which caused such a boom in wool? I've noticed that north-west Cornwall has much more Devon-style names, which, going by the technique of roads etc., is additional hilly than the rest of Cornwall (I am from Australia by the way, so I primarily know Devon and Cornwall by maps and photos). Do you know of anywhere online I could view a smaller sized scale map of Devon which includes farmsteads and hamlets? The concept that the Saxons decided to borrow a lot of additional Celtic names in Devon and also the west than elsewhere in England is indicative of your great lengths some people are prepared to go to in help of their pet concepts; it's practically laughable to feel (and realise!) that some historians take the concept seriously. Speaking of such suggestions, I think I've heard it stated that the prefix 'beer' (as in Beercrocombe) is of Saxon origin. It seems to become virtually exclusively confined for the south-western peninsula of Britain, so I have wondered whether or not it is actually basically of Celtic origin. Would that be a appropriate assumption?

Einion, I had a rapid search on-line, but I couldn't locate any maps of Devon, which show detail down to person farms. To obtain an precise impression with the place-name components employed for farms and hamlets, there isn't any substitute for the GB Ordnance Survey 1:50,000 and 1:25,000 series maps. Having said that in her book "The Landscape of Place-Names", Margaret Gelling states: "Combe is a lot far more prevalent in South West England than in any other area. Ekwall (1960) contains 42 settlement-names containing 'combe' in Somerset, 36 in Devon and 26 in Dorset. The statistic of 36 key names does not give an adequate impression with the use of 'combe' in Devon. She has identified an Old English word 'cumb', meaning 'cup' or 'bowl', which she thinks may well be the origin with the place-natoms shoes outletme element 'combe', as quite a few from the instances of 'combe' are bowl shaped valleys. Nevertheless, she then admits: "A excellent numerous from the 'combe' names in Devon don't refer to 'cumb' shaped valleys." She attempts to explain this observation by postulating that by the time that the Saxons migrated from Somerset and Dorset into Devon, they had almost certainly forgotten that 'combe' referred to bowl shaped valleys only, so started to apply the name to all valleys. I will leave it to your typical sense to decide regardless of whether such a tortuous explanation has any merit, but as the Celtic word 'combe' (Welsh, 'cwm') refers to most forms of valley (aside from steep sided gorges), this would look to me to become by far one of the most probably explanation for 'combe' names all through the South West. The place-name element 'beer' or 'bere' is actually a additoms outlettional tough 1 to pin down. There is certainly certainly an Old English word 'bearu', meaning 'small wood', and this is the derivation normally provided by the so-called place-name specialists. Nonetheless, there is a Celtic word 'ber' which means a promontory, which they only assign 'bere' names to if there is certainly an incredibly clear existence of a promontory and there is absolutely no indication of there ever getting been a tiny wood within the region (like Bere Alston and Bere Ferrers, which both lie on the promontory of land in between the Tamar along with the Tavy rivers). Due to their reluctance to use the Celtic 'ber' derivation, unless forced to complete so, it truly is attainable (if not probable) that you will discover numerous much more instances of 'beer' or 'bere' names in the South West, that are definitely Celtic in origin.

Plymouth Exile, Looking again at the Road Atlas of Britain, 'combe' certainly does stand out as a widespread location name element in Devon. Anyway, I believe I've a bit of frequent sense however it appears that Margaret Gelling is ready to forfeit some when analysing components of spot names inside the West Nation. As you mentioned DNA tests in your previous message, I was questioning if they took into account pre-saxon invasions, including Beaker Folk or even earlier, which would possibly cause the Saxon element inside the population to seem higher than it seriously is. I realize the survey with the Midlands led by Mark Thomas did take this into account as significantly as possible. But do you know if this was the case with the West Country surveys and Blood of your Vikings? If 20 to 25 % of Devon's population had been Saxon, I would have thought that the Celtic language may perhaps not have survived so long as it did.

Einion, I have picked up a 1:50,000 scale OS map at random and opened it up at the initial fold. It shows the 65 square mile area bounded by Exeter within the North, Newton Abbot inside the South West and the River Exe inside the East. I have counted each of the location names that are either entirely Celtic (like Dunchideock or Pennycombe) or which include a Celtic root (such as Smallicombe). The total of such Celtic names is 47, of which 19 include the root 'combe' and one consists of the root 'tre'. This provides a rough idea from the density of such names in Devon (total region two,591 square miles). The Blood with the Vikings survey is reported in "A Y Chromosome Census from the British Isles", which can be offered to view on line. It looks at the Y-Chromosome variations, which exist today, with no speculation getting created concerning the genetic composition of pre-Iron Age settlers, which include the Beaker Folk. However, it really is unlikely that any earlier migrants had exactly the same genetic signature as the Saxons; otherwise this would have shown up inside the present day Welsh population. I do not have much details concerning the West Nation surveys, apart from the truth that the general conclusion was drawn that there have been no substantial differences involving the Cornish along with the Devonians. I never see any issue together with the survival in the Brythonic Language on account of the presence of a 25% Saxon element inside the population, as we understand that this was definitely the case in Cornwall. The truth is in Cumbria, the Brythonic Language survived until effectively soon after the Norman Conquest, regardless of the truth that the Y Chromosome census reveals a 40% Germanic element inside the population in that area.

Hi, everybody, I have been interested in Devon's Celtic past for a lot of years now, and lately posted a couple of contributions around the Celtic Devon thread. An extremely superior resource for placename analysis and effectively as just acquiring your way in regards to the UK, could be the multimap resource at multimap-dot-com. It truly is free of charge to make use of and displays maps down to hamlet and farm level. I recently did a random scan of Devon and identified examples of your surviving Celtic names which have been discussed on this thread, plus two incidences of a hamlet name 'Lana' which may perhaps derive in the old word for church or enclosed land, as in Welsh 'Llan' or the anglicised Devon names Landklongchamp saleey (Church of St Kea), Landcross and Landcove. The name Lana also exists in Cornwall. An additional point to add towards the Celtic placenames debate is that the pre-Saxon Celts of Dumnonia had few identified significant centres of population. The only large spot, Exeter (Isca or Keresk), becoming of course in Devon. Outside of Exeter they seem to possess been a primarily agrarian folks living extensively scattered in really small groups. This reality is represented in the Celtic placenames that survive in Devon today. The good farmland in Devon and lack of all-natural barriers created Devon much more susceptible to Saxon settlement than Cornwall. With Cornwall, the Tamar and the rugged interior acted as a organic brake to further settlement by the English, as did not surprisingly, Norman the Conqueror's invasion! By that point the capital of Cornwall was in the Saxon town of Launceston, in the east of the county, where it remained for centuries afterwards. Devon, in contrast, features a considerably higher quantity of Saxon-era and early medieval settlements, which like their contemporaries in Cornwall-Helston and Launceston-bear either English or anglicised names. Also settlements in Devon generally bear hybrid names, made up of each British and English words, but the bias of placename research constantly provides the English component predominance. Even clearly anglicised Celtic names are attributed solely to English when, as inside the Pennycombe-Penycwm instance cited by Plymouth Exile, or in Cwmbran-Branscombe, the former being a Welsh town, the latter a village in east Devon, the original root is much more probably to possess been the British language. Some say cwm-combe is an English word, later borrowed into Welsh and other Brythonic languages, however the toms outlet store onlineother components of each of these names are the exact same in Devon as they're in Wales. As an afterthought I obtain just about the most intriguing Anglo-Saxon placenames of Devon is Stockleigh English, in mid-Devon. Stockleigh English lies close to the region I was brought up in, and I usually wondered why, as we're in England, the village's name should really need to so boldly assert the reality! I not too long ago discovered, just inside the English border with Wales, close to Monmouth, there are two villages called English Bicknor and Welsh Bicknor. Provided that there is certainly likely a absolutely rational standard placename explanation for Stockleigh to declare its Englishness in mid-Devon, with no bringing in 'Wealcyn' or other such mysterious people who should happen to be in Cornwall, I am not going to suggest something additional!

ExeValleyBoy, You raise an intriguing point regarding the presence of English Bicknor and Welsh Bicknor within the Wye Valley area. There is also the pair of villages in Shropshire known as English Frankton and Welsh Frankton, which are also close for the Welsh border. As outlined by "Celtic Voices English Places" by Richard Coates and Andrew Breeze, significantly with the region close for the Welsh border was Welsh speaking territory up until comparatively modern day occasions, this being reflected in the substantial number of Welsh place-names thereabouts. It truly is therefore almost specific that these names arose in an effort to distinguish between English and Welsh speaking settlements in the exact same name. Regarding the name Stockleigh English in Devon, there is absolutely no balancing 'Stockleigh Welsh' or 'Stockleigh Cornish' name. One could thus conjecture that it acquired the 'English' element to recognize an location where a group of English (Saxon) settlers lived amongst a predominantly indigenous British population. I can think about no other explanation why the appellation 'English' would have already been added, and this explanation would tie in together with the Welsh border instances. I've observed the contention that the Welsh word 'cwm' was a borrowed English word, on a preceding occasion, but not in any serious place-name study, exactly where it really is generally stated that the borrowing is within the other direction. Even Margaret Gelling, who has postulated that most of the English 'combe' names are derived from an old English word for bowl or cup, admits that there is a genuine Brythonic word 'cumm' or 'cumb' (valley), that is noticed inside the Welsh 'cwm'. I think that if 'cwm' had been a word borrowed from English, 1 would anticipate to view lots of more situations of its usage in Welsh regions close towards the border with England, but this really is not the case, since it toms outlet storeobserved often all more than Wales. There is a further feasible derivation with the name 'Branscombe', aside from it being the equivalent of the Welsh 'Cwmbran' (Valley of crows). It could be St. Brannock's Valley, but this is almost certainly significantly less probably as the influence of St. Brannock was a lot more apparent in North Devon about Braunton, than in South East Devon.

ExeValleyBoy, While Exeter/Keresk could have already been the only town or city in Devon in pre-Saxon occasions, it was not the only settlement. I can think about two with Celtic links with respect to name. Newton Abbot seems quintessentially English in nomenclature, however the region was also called 'Penn'. A road junction for the west of Newton Abbot nonetheless bears this name. Possibly this represents two settlements - a single Saxon one particular Celtic - that eventually merged, or perhaps two unique names existed for the identical town - once again suggesting some survival of Briton speakers in the area. The other one that springs to thoughts is Barnstaple, which is recorded as being founded by the Saxons, and however can also be recognized by the Celto-Roman name of Barum to locals. Possibly this was the name of a native settlement that became enveloped inside the developing town, or probably it was the name with the region (as opposed to the town). The fact that in all 3 circumstances (Exeter/Newton Abbott/Barnstaple)it was the English name which came to be accepted almost certainly reflects the social dominance of your English language. [By this I refer towards the theory as to why the Britons appear to have adopted the English language while DNA proof suggests they remain the biggest percentage on the population. Basically this states that the English language progressively became noticed to become observed of superior status. Whilst lots of Britons would have continued to speak Celtic amongst themselves over time (and in Devon's case this was centuries) the Celtic usage dwindled into disuse].

Although many Anglo-Saxonists appear keen to deny it, the truth remains that a conquered population imposing their language

a book to movie review of Time Traveler Wife-spun2

a book to movie overview of Time Traveler Wife

Possibly I having softer with age, it is pretty possible mainly because my buddtoms outlet storey who commonly loves longchamp saleromance filmcheap toms shoess hated Time Traveler Wife whilst I walked out from the theater getting enchanted by the story. Generatoms shoeslly I despise romantic movies and keep away from them like some mass media warned pandemic, but I was sold on toms outletthis film when I saw Rachel McAdams on Each day Show producing a muddle of her interview with Jon Stewart. She mentioned just enough, even though giving away the majority of the plot, that I believed the flick could be worth my time. Is it sappy? You bet. Is it the kind of love story that has in no way been told before? Yes inside a good way, and no in a predictable Story kind of way.

Depending on the 2003 novel by Audrey Niffenegger of ytoms shoes outletour very same name, thtoms outlet storee story revolves around Henry (Eric Bana) who includes a genetic disorder that causes him to travel by way of time. He 1st meets Clare (McAdams) though he is functioning as a librarian and she recognizes him although he has no thought who she is. She tells him that she knows about his condition, which not merely causes him to vanish but to reappear at some other time without having a stitch of clothes. Therefore it can be safe to say that consistent relationships aren definitely his point except he finds it incredible that an individual is capable to accept him as he's.

My friend thought the time traveling premise didn fulfill the criteria for suitable suspension of disbelief, but I believed it did. Immediately after all, hetoms shoes outlet does go to a medical professional who wins some significant medical science prize for the discovery from the situation, but all round I consider it truly is the chemistry among the each likeable McAdams and Bana that really tends to make this film perform for me. The time traveling element alterations this romantic ftoms outletilm from being just an additional rlong champun from the mill romantic flick to being anything that transcends the genre not within the case of my pal. I actually didn thoughts that Bana would from time to time have conversations with younger or older versions of himself or that he meets his future wife when she is just a child obtaining a picnic by herself (okay that may possibly be pushing the suspension of disbelief a little due to the fact most young children don pack picnics for themselves).

Time Traveler Wife isn necessarily a film a single have to rush out to view. It can make for a excellent DVD viewing or cable. I give it valuable pink manicured thumbs up.Related articles:

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